I sat at my desk at work today and almost burst out laughing.
I was reading the DET account of Greg Smith's departure from Derbyshire and read the following:
""I was looking to stay and I told them I wanted to stay but they have told me they are not going to renew my contract," said Smith.
They said the money I was looking for was too much, which I don't think was the case because I know what other people have signed for.
I've had a few counties interested. I made no secret that people wanted to talk to me but I kept them on hold because I told them I wanted to stay at Derby and see how things were going here but it hasn't worked out that way.
They are looking at people like Collingwood, who are coming to the end of their careers and would be on a lot more money than me, but I'm just coming to my peak.
Fair enough, if that's the way they want to go but it's disappointing because the chairman has said the club is trying to keep its best players and I consider myself one of the best players in the side for the last couple or three years. I haven't asked for any more money than the contract I was offered by John."
There's a strange old rationale in the argument there. For one thing, I'm not sure Smith is one of the best players in the side. If you asked me about least expendable players and who I'd be sad to see go, Smith wouldn't be in the top eight. As I've said before, he rarely influences games, scores quick thirties/forties then gives it away and can be infuriatingly erratic in his bowling at times. Yes, he can score quickly, yes he can take wickets, but he doesn't do either in sufficient quantities to make a real contribution.
Let's not forget a few factual issues either. We offered him a long term contract at the end of last season which he refused. It was then felt that we could not give him the captaincy if he was going to be looking elsewhere this season and he went public to the DET about his ambitions, putting in 28 days notice on the club two months ago.
After SIX seasons he is still not English qualified and costs us money every time he plays. Having made his debut for us at age 22, he struggled badly for two or three seasons but we stuck with him, despite nigh-annual stories that he was off to Kent/Surrey/Essex - wherever. Since 2006 he has scored one century a season, taken forty wickets once and thirty once. Twice he has taken five in an innings. See what I mean about influencing matches?
He said that he was not asking for any more money than the contract offered by John Morris, which poses the question as to why he turned that down. He had the opportunity of an extended contract AND the captaincy, yet still said no. One is left with the impression, rightly or wrongly, that he turned it down because he wanted to use Derbyshire as leverage to get a better offer elsewhere.
Turning it on its head, you could read into it that he now "really wants to stay" because other counties have cooled their interest in him, feeling that in this economic climate his record doesn't justify such an outlay, one that I understand is in the same bracket as that sought by Graham Wagg last year.
If anyone out there thinks that Glamorgan did well out of signing Wagg - and previously Jim Allenby - on such money, look at the state of the Welsh county, who we hammered twice. Morale is supposedly poor because of the disparity in salaries there and it can be little coincidence that their chairman, Paul Russell, has retired through ill-health. The club spent big in the hope that they would coin it in from staging international cricket and it hasn't come off at all.
For what its worth, I think Chris Grant has played a stormer in retracting Derbyshire contract offer. If a potential suitor is having second thoughts, Smith could be left without a county and feel that Derbyshire's best offer remains his preference. Having been messed about, we then end up paying over the score ourselves, having tried our best to make a deal. If Smith comes back - which I don't think will happen - it should be on our terms, not his.
I have said before and will do so again. No player is bigger than a club. Boycott, perhaps the closest I saw in my lifetime, wasn't bigger than Yorkshire, Botham wasn't bigger than Somerset. Smith isn't in the same league as a player, so as far as I am concerned, the club have done exactly the right thing.
Greg Smith may be right. Perhaps he is coming to his peak. Maybe a move will galvanise him into scoring a thousand runs, the benchmark of a good player and still to be attained by him. Maybe he will go on to better things, playing a prominent role in success at another club.
Or maybe he could go the way of plenty of others who thought the grass would be greener elsewhere. Matt Cassar, Adrian Rollins, Robin Weston and Graham Wagg will vouch for the fact that isn't always the case.
Time will tell, but no tears from me on this one.
PS We lost today, despite a fighting finish. Credit to the boys for that. But as Scarlett O'Hara said, tomorrow is another day.
PPS Those less expendable players? Try Redfern, Madsen, Whiteley, Knight, Groenewald, Palladino, Hughes, Clare, Durston. That's nine for starters...
Spot on, completely agree. We can't carry people who's heart isn't with the club.
ReplyDeleteIn my opinion he shouldn't be picked again now and others such as Borrington and Lineker should be given an opportunity to impress.
I don,t think you could have spelt it out any better peakfan. We all know he,s being playing Derbyshire off against other counties and it may well have backfired on him.
ReplyDeleteLet,s face it, He,s not exactly negotiating from a position of strenght,no matter who he may talk to. As you already know,had it been my decision he wouldn,t have been getting a new contract anyway.
Come the end of this season there will be any amount of players of a similar standard to Smith available and probably alot cheaper aswell. He,s Mr average and always has been. I don,t wish the bloke any ill but i for one will not be sorry to see him go. If the club is to make upward strides then there is no room for players like Smith. He,s not good enough and that,s the bottom line.
The chairman's offer to pay someone nearly £200,000 a year was always going to be brought up by any existing player wanting a new contract. I am not surprised that Smith has brought this up. Smith is one of our best players in all forms of the game with both bat and ball. If we have got this 'silly' money to throw about then Smith should have been offered a good deal. If he has however received a good offer and he has refused it then he should not be allowed to play for the club again. Let him go out on loan somewhere or maybee use Uncle Ashley's apparent new transfer system!
ReplyDeleteIf it is true that the Chairman told Smith that he was not required on the eve of a match then this is bad! I wish the chairman would stay out of cricketing affairs and leave them to Krik. I am affraid whilst the Chairman continues to behave this way it is not good for the club. I would have thought that after sacking Morris and Brown in the middle of a match he might have learned a little but it seems his arrogogance gets in the way of any common sense.
ReplyDeleteSorry, I don't go along with this line of argument at all. Greg Smith is and has been one of the best three players in our side for the last three years and I, for one will be very sorry to see him go. Our loss and another County's gain as far as I am concerned.
ReplyDeleteI think Greg Smith will be a loss to the club. I do think that his figures don't warrent the money he's allegedly after, but he has been one of the most consistent players over the past few seasons.
ReplyDeleteI think everyone's being a little harsh on Smith. I agree his conduct over the past couple of years hasn't exactly endeared himself, that he's a better player in his own head than he is on the field, and that he hasn't got close to realising his potential. My comment last night about the recklessness of his batting at 90-3 shows some of this irritation with him.
ReplyDeleteHowever, he's averaging almost 40, third in the batting averages and with more scores over 50 than anyone else apart from Redfern. He's our fourth highest wicket-taker and often bowls the most when things are at their hardest and cheap wickets aren't to be found. There have been several times this season when he's had to start the process of picking up the pieces of a batting car-crash.
Whether or not he's worth what he's asking, he is one of our best players, and probably is right that he's approaching his peak. I suspect that he will probably get better as he matures as a person, and that he is more a Blackwell or Cork than a Rollins or Cassar.
If he really wants to stay, and is prepared to moderate his financial demands, I'd be delighted to see him stay. We'll be the better team for him being here, and if we put aside some of our feelings about his behaviour, I think we'd all admit this.
As for leaving him out of the team for the rest of the year - talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face. We're paying him one of the higher salaries at the club and we're going to let him sit around doing nothing?
Whilst. I wholeheartedly agree with you.Greg Smith is a very talentedone day player,but as a 4 day man he lacks the mentality.I have posted lot about Smith , I have seen Derbyshire alot and in 4 day all I see is a bloke playing for his average and not his team.In the team huddles he never partakes,he is either above this sort of thing , or not invited.One of the biggest mistakes Johnny Morris/the Club made was making him the one day captain last year,and, ever since that ,he has tried to use that as some sort of leverage. wish hiim luck but I will not shed a tear when he leaves.
ReplyDeleteDonny Scorpion
Greg Smith did not ask for a lot of money, trust me, we are now losing another top player, Why did the Chairman tell him on the eve of a big game,??????? what is it to do with him?? Karl is director of cricket???? i thought,,Grant is Chairman of the Committee for one year,also if we make a profit this year, it will be down to Don Amott, he did the budget
ReplyDeleteNo way is Clare better than Smith
ReplyDeleteI hope we arent asset stripping to pay for landmark signing, its okay offering cheap youngsters 3 year deals but we need more than them and Groenwald.
Annon, do we actually know the circumstances in which he was told? What if he asked the chairman about the situation on the eve of the game? Was he supposed to lie then break the news after the game? I honestly don't know how it was done but maybe others do. Anyway, has it been confirmed that KK is in charge next season and do we know what say he had in the decision? Just maybe, he agreed with Chris Grant.
ReplyDeleteThose who think Smith is a good player are talking nonsense. Look at the facts. He is not a top six county batsman. Where are you coming from?. As peakfan says,here is a player who has never achieved a thousand runs in a season and whilst he has been a reasonable bowler,that,s all he has been.Reasonable.
ReplyDeletePeople are quick to criticise poor performances and i do my fair share.but Smith,more often than not,leaves the door wide open. He,s always done enough,just enough,to avoid direct criticism. An odd score here and a few wickets there,but im sorry folks,its not nearly enough.
When all is said and done,the fact he is leaving is down to him. He cannot blame anyone else. Why are people shedding crocodile tears for a player who has been offered a contract and refused it. Thats right,refused it. Perhaps he is having second thoughts,maybe because nobody else wants him,but it,s too late now and it serves him right. We are not a convienience or a stepping stone for other counties and If people don,t want to stay then let,s get rid and have done with it.
There is no reason whatsoever for selecting Smith in any future game. Get him out the door and let,s play someone who sees their future with Derbyshire. He may be coming to his peak,but in his case it,s a very small mountain.
All this nonsense about the chairman interfering with cricketing matters is simply not true. He is merely stating the facts as they stand and anyone with a modicom of common sense can see this. Let Smith try pastures new. I dare bet here and now the county that signs him will wish they hadn,t.
if smith wanted to stay he would have signed last year. things move on. if he wanted to stay he would have signed. then again he maybe he did want to stay and got poor advice from his agent. but again it is his decision alone.speculation gets us nowhere. as for krik lets hope he picks them and then leaves the contracts to the bussinessman
ReplyDeleteShades of 606 on this issue - dare to disagree and get abused.
ReplyDeleteExactly when did Smith become public enemy number one? Yes his lack of consistency and failure to realise his potential is frustrating, but he's not alone in that, and others don't attract the same vitriol. He's not played a good hand in the current situation, and possibly a manipulative one, but he's not alone in engineering his departure in such a way as to make him look the injured party and others weren't vilified in the same way. I've seen comments about body language and lack of team-mindedness, and haven't seen enough recently to comment on this, but it must say something that Sutton wants him in the team even now.
There's an interesting point about how much the bid for Collingwood has contributed to Smith's position. He raised the comparison himself, in the context that he's at or approaching his peak, and Derbyshire are prepared to pay much more for someone well past his best. It's worth reflecting that Peakfan's guess at the offer to Collingwood is twice what he thinks Smith may have been looking for, and probably three times what he's on at the moment.
A quick look at the statistics for both show that Smith isn't far off in comparing himself to Collingwood. At 28, Collingwood averaged 31.8 with the bat (Smith 31.5), ands 39.2 with the ball (Smith 35.5). Collingwood had 8 centuries and 28 half-centuries, and Smith 5 and 29. Collingwood hadn't taken 5 wickets in a match, and Smith has done it twice, and taken close to twice as many wickets as Collingwood at the same stage. Even accepting that all of Smith's performances have been in Div 2 and even at that time, Collingwood would have played at least a couple of seasons in Div 1, their records are very similar - with Smith the better bowler and Collingwood slightly better at converting 50's into 100's. Of course it doesn't mean that Smith's future progress will mirror Collingwood, but he isn't being so fanciful in drawing the comparison.
Some good points anon - why not append a name to your post, even if not your own?
ReplyDeleteIf I heard Smith was staying I'd be happy. I would not deny that he is a player of ability - the issue is harnessing that on a more regular basis and making a better case for more money.
I just don't think thst his record so far justifies his (or his agent's) stance and demands. He could well be a late developer, in which case his next contract is when he may get a better offer.
Fair enough,some rate Smith,others don,t. Nothing wrong in that. If we didn,t have differing opinions there would be no need for a blog.
ReplyDeleteI will conclude my part in this saga by saying,in my opinion, Smith is not good enough to be considered a front line batsmen. He doesn,t score enough runs and that is the fact of the matter. Smith has been around longer than anyone else in the squad, so i don,t think judging him now,after several seasons is unreasonable.
He obviously rates himself far higher than than the club do,in which case he will have to offer himself to another employer. Smith has forced the club,s hand,not the other way round.
To talk of Collingwood being an issue with Smith is ludicrous. There was no mention of Collingwood until a few weeks ago,a helluva long time after he refused a new contract. He,s using it as an excuse. Anyone can see that. We haven,t even got Collingwood and for the record,i have serious reservations as to his suitability and yes,his salary.
Anyway,Smith has shot himself in the foot,one way and another and as i said earlier,we have nothing to gain from his continued presence in the team. What would Fergie do in this situation?.
Interesting comments and I can see both points of view. The main reason for this is that Smith has shown potential to be so much better than his current stats and therefore frustrated people. All rounders such as himself who can bat at 6 and bowl decent amounts of overs are worth their weight in gold and if he was averaging 40 with the bat and 25 with the ball he would have been out of Derbyshire a long time ago. Still think he will be missed as he helps balance the team and get the impression that his agent has not given him the greatest advice over the last year.
ReplyDeleteHaving said that would you have committed to the county so far in advance with so many changes likely to happen ie: changes in coach/chairman etc? Why not wait and see what's on the table
An interesting discussion. I'm uncerain why Smith has attracted such vitriol. After all his championship batting average is higher than Wes Durstons, who has rightly attracted praise this season. His averages over the last couple of seasons surely demonstrate he was a competent no 6 batsmen and change bowler with the potential to be better. He was also an excellent fielder and versatile enough to contribute in all forms if the game. I will be sorry to see him go.
ReplyDeleteHaving saId that I don't think it was necessarily the wrong decision. Firstly, he is plainly asking for a lot of money, probably too much, especially given what expectations that would create in other members of the squad. Secondly, his curious failure to become England qualified. I don't know the details of this, but surely he could have become qualified by now, which would have demonstrated a commitment to the county and saved his employers money.
Hopefully the likes of Whitely will be able to step up next season. I do think we will miss him and I hope he does well in the future.
Spireite Tim
Anon at 5.42 was me - my name was on it but obviously didn't register. I'm not a Smith lover, nor even admirer particularly, but his results demand respect. He's been the glue often enough over seven very difficult years to a) impress with his spirit and resilience and b) frustrate you that he doesn't do it more often. I'd still rather have him on my side than the other, and if there is a window of opportunity open for compromise at a reasonable cost, I'd like it to be left open rather than have the supporters put a fist of bitterness through it.
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure mention of Collingwood was necessarily ludicrous. I have to be honest - if I were in Smith's position and had been wanting to reach an agreement that would let me stay (and perhaps had been working towards it with the management), the news that Derbyshire might have been prepared to pay a player with less to offer more than twice as much would have hardened my bargaining position as well.
Let's not say things that might make a compromise harder to reach (assuming it's possible at this stage) and if he does go, at least recognise what he has done for us over the years - and however frustrated we are that he didn't do more, just bear in mind what he did in some very hard circumstances at times. Bad advice or bad negotiating - surely. Bad guy - surely not?
See my forthcoming post - no, not a bad guy at all but perhaps poorly advised? Hopefully the next post will clarify my thoughts, but thanks to all of you for some interesting thoughts on a player who has polarised opinion.
ReplyDelete